Leigh Sales on the bold show that puts 15 autistic students in charge (2024)

Amanda Keller is sitting before a group of journalism students fielding questions about everything from her radio career to her stint as a reporter on the TV show Beyond 2000, her IVF struggles and her husband’s Parkinson’s disease. Then comes a question that truly takes Keller by surprise: “What is the last sound you want to hear before you die?”

It’s an extraordinary question and the kind of moment that sums up The Assembly, which features neurodivergent trainee journalism students mentored by the ABC’s Leigh Sales interviewing Australian celebrities.

“That was incredible,” says Sales of the Keller question. “The other question that I thought was so interesting and really illustrated the power of this format was when Savannah asked her ‘Do you love your husband?’

“If I was asking someone about their wife or their husband. I wouldn’t phrase that question like that, but because it was phrased like that, it’s very front-and-centre in Amanda’s mind how much she loves her husband because of his Parkinson’s. So that got a particular answer from Amanda ... that someone like me wouldn’t have got from her.”

The show is based on the French production Les Rencontres du Papotin, which included interviews with French President Emmanuel Macron and Call My Agent actor Camille Cottin. It became the most watched unscripted French show in 2023 and was followed by a BBC special earlier this year that featured Welsh actor Michael Sheen being similarly quizzed about everything from Tom Jones to Moana.

Both shows were lauded for being a breath of fresh air and a respite from standard political and celebrity interviews that were usually too cautious or just plain boring. (As someone who regularly interviews celebrities, the fault lies on both sides: yes, sometimes the questions can be boring, but sometimes the person being interviewed is also quite uninterested in participating.)

The Australian adaptation features 15 autistic students, aged between 18 and 44, who have been guided by Sales - as well as lecturers at Sydney’s Macquarie University - in interview and research techniques. They tackle a new celebrity each week, culminating in a filmed group interview in an autism-friendly space, with the students able to take breaks if they become overwhelmed or uncomfortable.

Sales agreed to take part after watching the Macron episode of the French production. “After so many years at 7.30, one of the frustrations I had is that celebrities or politicians come in and they’re so media trained, it’s hard to get to the real person,” she says.

“And I saw that the way that the autistic journalists asked questions of Emmanuel Macron, you couldn’t really spin or get out of it. And it was also very engaging because of the unusual questions that could come at him and I just found it such a compelling piece of TV.”

One of the journalism students taking part in the ABC version, 18-year-old Dale from Sydney, hadn’t really thought about journalism before his mum signed him up to The Assembly. After some hesitation, he found his feet.

“Before the course started, my nerves and anxiety were through the roof,” says Dale. “I remember talking to my mum and I was like ‘I might drop out, I might not do this at all’ and she was like ‘just give it a day, see if you love it’.

“The first day was lovely, I could not stop talking about it. And I remember the day of the interview, I was so nervous. I was shaking, I just didn’t know what to do. Who gets to be in a room with a celebrity to interview them? It’s never happened [to me]. So it was a very surreal and nerve-racking experience.”

For the celebrities taking part – Keller, presenter Hamish Blake, actor Sam Neill, AFL star Adam Goodes, singer Delta Goodrem and Prime Minister Anthony Albanese – it was a vulnerable experience. There were no limits on the interview and all questions – personal and professional – were expected to be answered.

“Hamish had some really great insights about it, where he was saying one of the really interesting things was every question, whether it’s a really light-hearted one or whether it’s a really deep, serious one, everything’s asked with the same level of intensity,” says Sales.

“The interviewee has to be really on their toes the whole time because you never know what’s coming. And the other thing that really struck Hamish was, and I think this was true, is that there was no agenda.

“When everyone’s asking their questions, it’s just motivated from genuine curiosity or their interests or their own experiences. No one’s looking for a gotcha or out to get anybody, and I think the interviewees are able to sense that, and so that helps them relax and feel more connected.”

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Of all those who were approached to be interviewed, Sales was most surprised Albanese agreed.

“I feel like I owe him one,” says Sales. “Because you can imagine how that pitch went, ‘Prime Minister, could you come in for an interview and it’s going to be a group of 15 autistic people. They can ask you whatever they like. I’ll have limited control over the situation and it goes for about an hour and a half. How does that sound?’ It’s a politician’s worst nightmare.”

For the record, says Dale, Albanese was a “chill guy that just answered your questions”.

Each of the students has been given a paid internship at the ABC and Dale will start in news graphics in September. “I didn’t really see many autistic journalists in the media, but now learning about it and being a part of it, I think autistic journalists are the future,” he says.

“They have some of the most brilliant questions and I think more people [with autism] should be in the industry … because [they] would bring such a unique perspective.”

Sales agrees. “This show, we showed that you could make – let’s just forget about the kind of worthy aspect of it and creating a voice for people with autism – we showed that you could work with, not just the people on air, but some of the crew as well, you could work with tons of neurodiverse people on a team and make a super-entertaining television show. It required some adjustments, but generally, it worked very smoothly ... so it’s possible.”

The Assembly begins on Tuesday, August 20, at 8.30pm on the ABC.

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